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From: Tamas Blummer <tamas@bitsofproof.com>
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Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 10:17:04 +0200
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Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Missing fRelayTxes in version
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I agree that this can be deferred until there is an actual new field =
without any harm. But then remember to update the BIP37 too saying that =
it is optional only if flag added in BIPXX is not present.
Your argument is that this complexity is already there so why not =
preserve it. I think eliminating complexity (that has no benefit) =
strengthens the system.
Tam=E1s Blummer
http://bitsofproof.com
On 20.06.2013, at 09:36, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99.net> wrote:
> Sure but why not do that when there's an actual new field to add? Does =
anyone have a proposal for a feature that needs a new version field at =
the moment? There's no point changing the protocol now unless there's =
actually a new field to add.
>=20
> Anyway I still don't see why anyone cares about this issue. The =
Bitcoin protocol does not and never has required that all messages have =
a fixed number of fields per version. Any parser written on the =
assumption it did was just buggy. Look at how tx messages are relayed =
for the most obvious example of that pattern in action - it's actually =
the raw byte stream that's stored and relayed to ensure that fields =
added in new versions aren't dropped during round-tripping. Old versions =
are supposed to preserve fields from the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 9:30 AM, Tamas Blummer <tamas@bitsofproof.com> =
wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>=20
> The issue with the current parser is that those fields are =
conditionally optional on that there will be no subsequent fields added.
> If there will be further fields they will become manadory.=20
> =20
> Why not bump the version and parse the fields as mandatory from then =
on? This would be backward compatible and cleaner
> going forward.
>=20
> Tamas Blummer
> http://bitsofproof.com
>=20
>=20
> =
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>=20
>=20
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Diso-8859-1"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div =
apple-content-edited=3D"true"><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: =
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
"><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: =
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-align: left; ">I agree that this can be deferred until there is an =
actual new field without any harm. But then remember to update the BIP37 =
too saying that it is optional only if flag added in BIPXX is not =
present.</div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; =
orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-align: left; "><br></div><div =
style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; =
font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: =
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-align: left; ">Your argument is that this complexity is already =
there so why not preserve it. I think eliminating complexity (that =
has no benefit) strengthens the system.</div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-align: left; "><br></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: =
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
"><b>Tam=E1s Blummer</b></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: =
0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
"><a href=3D"http://bitsofproof.com/"><span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); ">http://bitsofproof.com</span></span></a></div></div><a =
href=3D"http://bitsofproof.com/" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; =
orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; ">
</a></div><br><div><div>On 20.06.2013, at 09:36, Mike Hearn <<a =
href=3D"mailto:mike@plan99.net">mike@plan99.net</a>> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div =
dir=3D"ltr">Sure but why not do that when there's an actual new field to =
add? Does anyone have a proposal for a feature that needs a new version =
field at the moment? There's no point changing the protocol now unless =
there's actually a new field to add.<div>
<br></div><div style=3D"">Anyway I still don't see why anyone cares =
about this issue. The Bitcoin protocol does not and never has required =
that all messages have a fixed number of fields per version. Any parser =
written on the assumption it did was just buggy. Look at how tx messages =
are relayed for the most obvious example of that pattern in action - =
it's actually the raw byte stream that's stored and relayed to ensure =
that fields added in new versions aren't dropped during round-tripping. =
Old versions are supposed to preserve fields from the future.</div>
<div style=3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 9:30 AM, Tamas Blummer =
<span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:tamas@bitsofproof.com" =
target=3D"_blank">tamas@bitsofproof.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 =
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div =
style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:-webkit-auto;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;t=
ext-transform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helveti=
ca;word-spacing:0px">
<div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
Hi Mike,</div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
<br></div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
The issue with the current parser is that those fields are conditionally =
optional on that there will be no subsequent fields added.</div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
If there will be further fields they will become =
manadory. </div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
</div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
Why not bump the version and parse the fields as mandatory from =
then on? This would be backward compatible and cleaner</div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
going forward.</div><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:left;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-tran=
sform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-=
spacing:0px">
<br></div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:-webkit-auto;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;t=
ext-transform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helveti=
ca;word-spacing:0px">
<span>Tamas Blummer</span></div><div =
style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-al=
ign:-webkit-auto;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;t=
ext-transform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Helveti=
ca;word-spacing:0px">
<span><span style=3D""><a href=3D"http://bitsofproof.com/" =
target=3D"_blank">http://bitsofproof.com</a></span></span></div></font></s=
pan></div><a href=3D"http://bitsofproof.com/" =
style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:medium;font-style:normal;font-var=
iant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;te=
xt-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:norm=
al;word-spacing:0px" target=3D"_blank">
=
</a></div><br></div><br>--------------------------------------------------=
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elopment</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
</blockquote></div><br></body></html>=
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