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Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Censorship
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Yup I've been looking over twister thoroughly this week, it's very close to what I'm thinking and I'm sure the developer of that could easily do the project I'm doing. However he decided to make an alt coin and didn't use the real blockchain, which makes his network weak. It's a waste to not take advantage of the immense bitcoin computing power for this. I'm only planning on storing hashes in the blockchain though to prevent data bloat, and the parallel program which stores all the data will be a lot like twister. Additionally I'm going to take it beyond a messaging system, will be able to literally upload anything and everything to this system. Theres no limit to what this de-centralized system can do if designed correctly. Crypto graffiti has given a taste of that by uploading jpeg and png to the blockchain.
Will be working on this 24/7 until the first release, will definitely tell you and others when the code is ready to be looked over. Fortunately I am employed by bitcoin so I can focus on this
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Wozniak <mwozniak@itbit.com>
To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol.com>
Sent: Mon, Aug 31, 2015 09:15 AM
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Censorship
<div id="AOLMsgPart_2_3e2f989c-2ac0-4675-a613-58f047c46a67">
<div class="aolReplacedBody">
<div dir="ltr">
Have you seen this:
<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="http://twister.net.co/">http://twister.net.co/</a>
<div>
It sounds very similar to what you're trying to do. Also, I'd be willing to help out in the form of running some alpha/beta software as part of the network once you get something working. Depending what languages you're writing in, I might help with code.
</div>
<div class="aolmail_gmail_extra">
<div class="aolmail_gmail_quote">
On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 8:06 AM, Zach G via bitcoin-dev
<span dir="ltr"><<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>></span> wrote:
<blockquote class="aolmail_gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<font color="black" size="2" face="arial"><font face="arial" color="black" size="2"><font size="2">The de-centralized forum directly integrates the Bitcoin blockchain with every post. I can see how you misunderstood since I wasn't specific in my first email. I'm surprised no one has done this yet, people have done things very similar but never took the leap to integrate the actual Bitcoin blockchain. Basically <a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="http://cryptograffiti.info/">http://cryptograffiti.info/</a> but with a parallel program that stores most of the data in a hash reference table, and shares that data via a torrent-esque system.
The Bitcoin of thoughts.</font></font>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">
<span>-----Original Message-----
From: Natanael <<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:natanael.l@gmail.com">natanael.l@gmail.com</a>>
To: NxtChg <<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:nxtchg@hush.com">nxtchg@hush.com</a>>
Cc: bitcoin-dev <<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>>; hurricanewarn1 <<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:hurricanewarn1@aol.com">hurricanewarn1@aol.com</a>>
Sent: Mon, Aug 31, 2015 7:46 am
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Censorship
</span>
<div class="aolmail_h5">
<div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
One last comment here on this topic;
<div dir="ltr">
For anybody who wants to discuss decentralized communication mechanisms in general, they can come to
<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="http://www.reddit.com/r/p2pcomms">www.reddit.com/r/p2pcomms</a> (up until these decentralized forums have become stable and common).
</div>
<div dir="ltr">
I've seen quite a few more of these projects lately, I want to make a list of them and would definitely like to contribute to making them not just usable, but good enough to gain popularity on their own.
</div>
<div dir="ltr">
(And in case you wonder about my approach to moderation: let every user pick which moderators / filters / servers he trusts, and let them share their subscription preferences in place of sharing links to centralized forums.)
</div>
<div dir="ltr">
- Sent from my phone
</div>
<div class="aolmail_gmail_quote">
Den 31 aug 2015 10:45 skrev "NxtChg via bitcoin-dev" <
<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>>:
<blockquote class="aolmail_gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
>I am creating a de-centralized forum, and I mean truly decentralized as I nor anyone else will be able to control it.
Zander is working on the same thing:
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="https://www.reddit.com/r/AetheralResearch/">https://www.reddit.com/r/AetheralResearch/</a>
But it's actually quite difficult to make it truly censorship-resistant: both in solving the theymos factor and spam/abuse/overloading as an attack.
>There is no doubt that the centralization and censorship of the Bitcoin community is massively inhibiting the advance of Bitcoin
>and also the growth of the Bitcoin economy. We are scaring away intellectuals, businessman, and newbies that are just getting started.
We have /r/bitcoinxt and so far it has been great. But we also need a regular forum.
Roger Ver controls
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="http://bitcoin.com">bitcoin.com</a>, as I understand?
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="https://bitcoin.com/forum/">https://bitcoin.com/forum/</a> would be nice.
And it must be a real community, not "say whatever you want because free speech". We've seen how that turned out to be.
Something like
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="http://battle.net">battle.net</a> or Steam forums: heavily moderated, not for opinions, but for spam/noise/insults.
Again, this needs leadership. Anyone can install a forum software, what is needed is an "official seal of approval" and regular presence of top XT people there.
And a will to setup proper moderation. Then people will move.
_______________________________________________
bitcoin-dev mailing list
<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div> </font>
_______________________________________________
bitcoin-dev mailing list
<a target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>
<a rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href="https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
------=_Part_43736_906136263.1441040415371
Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yup I've been looking over twister thoroughly this week, it's very close to=
what I'm thinking and I'm sure the developer of that could easily do the p=
roject I'm doing. However he decided to make an alt coin and didn't use the=
real blockchain, which makes his network weak. It's a waste to not take ad=
vantage of the immense bitcoin computing power for this. I'm only planning =
on storing hashes in the blockchain though to prevent data bloat, and the p=
arallel program which stores all the data will be a lot like twister. Addit=
ionally I'm going to take it beyond a messaging system, will be able to lit=
erally upload anything and everything to this system. Theres no limit to wh=
at this de-centralized system can do if designed correctly. Crypto graffiti=
has given a taste of that by uploading jpeg and png to the blockchain.&nbs=
p;<div><br></div><div>Will be working on this 24/7 until the first release,=
will definitely tell you and others when the code is ready to be looked ov=
er. Fortunately I am employed by bitcoin so I can focus on this <br><b=
r>-----Original Message-----<br>From: Michael Wozniak <mwozniak@itbit.co=
m><br>To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol.com><br>Sent: Mon, Au=
g 31, 2015 09:15 AM<br>Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Censorship<br><br><br>
<div id=3D"AOLMsgPart_2_3e2f989c-2ac0-4675-a613-58f047c46a67">
<div class=3D"aolReplacedBody">
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Have you seen this:
<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__h=
ref=3D"http://twister.net.co/">http://twister.net.co/</a>
<div>
<br>
</div>
<div>
It sounds very similar to what you're trying to do. Also, I'd be will=
ing to help out in the form of running some alpha/beta software as part of =
the network once you get something working. Depending what languages =
you're writing in, I might help with code.
</div>
</div>
<div class=3D"aolmail_gmail_extra">
<br>
<div class=3D"aolmail_gmail_quote">
On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 8:06 AM, Zach G via bitcoin-dev=20
<span dir=3D"ltr"><<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e=
37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org"=
>bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>></span> wrote:
<br>
<blockquote class=3D"aolmail_gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bor=
der-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<font color=3D"black" size=3D"2" face=3D"arial"><font face=3D"arial" co=
lor=3D"black" size=3D"2"><font size=3D"2">The de-centralized forum directly=
integrates the Bitcoin blockchain with every post. I can see how you misun=
derstood since I wasn't specific in my first email. I'm surprised no one ha=
s done this yet, people have done things very similar but never took the le=
ap to integrate the actual Bitcoin blockchain. Basically <a target=3D"_blan=
k" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"http://crypto=
graffiti.info/">http://cryptograffiti.info/</a> but with a parallel program=
that stores most of the data in a hash reference table, and shares that da=
ta via a torrent-esque system.<br> <br> The Bitcoin of thoughts.</fon=
t></font>=20
<div>=20
<br>=20
</div>=20
<div>=20
<br>=20
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">
<span>-----Original Message-----<br> From: Natanael <<a target=3D"=
_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"mailto:n=
atanael.l@gmail.com">natanael.l@gmail.com</a>><br> To: NxtChg <<a tar=
get=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"m=
ailto:nxtchg@hush.com">nxtchg@hush.com</a>><br> Cc: bitcoin-dev <<a t=
arget=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D=
"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfound=
ation.org</a>>; hurricanewarn1 <<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58e=
c13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"mailto:hurricanewarn1@aol.com">h=
urricanewarn1@aol.com</a>><br> Sent: Mon, Aug 31, 2015 7:46 am<br> Subje=
ct: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Censorship<br> <br> </span>
<div>
<div class=3D"aolmail_h5">
<div>=20
<div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
One last comment here on this topic;
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
For anybody who wants to discuss decentralized communication mechanisms in =
general, they can come to=20
<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd8=
51ae2f__href=3D"http://www.reddit.com/r/p2pcomms">www.reddit.com/r/p2pcomms=
</a> (up until these decentralized forums have become stable and common).
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
I've seen quite a few more of these projects lately, I want to make a list =
of them and would definitely like to contribute to making them not just usa=
ble, but good enough to gain popularity on their own.=20
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
(And in case you wonder about my approach to moderation: let every user pic=
k which moderators / filters / servers he trusts, and let them share their =
subscription preferences in place of sharing links to centralized forums.)=
=20
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
- Sent from my phone
</div>=20
<div class=3D"aolmail_gmail_quote">
Den 31 aug 2015 10:45 skrev "NxtChg via bitcoin-dev" <=20
<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd8=
51ae2f__href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@l=
ists.linuxfoundation.org</a>>:=20
<br>=20
<blockquote class=3D"aolmail_gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 =
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">=20
<br> >I am creating a de-centralized forum, and I mean truly=
decentralized as I nor anyone else will be able to control it.=20
<br>=20
<br> Zander is working on the same thing:=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-a=
ba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"https://www.reddit.com/r/AetheralResear=
ch/">https://www.reddit.com/r/AetheralResearch/</a>=20
<br>=20
<br> But it's actually quite difficult to make it truly censors=
hip-resistant: both in solving the theymos factor and spam/abuse/overloadin=
g as an attack.=20
<br>=20
<br>=20
<br> >There is no doubt that the centralization and censorsh=
ip of the Bitcoin community is massively inhibiting the advance of Bitcoin=
=20
<br> >and also the growth of the Bitcoin economy. We are sca=
ring away intellectuals, businessman, and newbies that are just getting sta=
rted.=20
<br>=20
<br> We have /r/bitcoinxt and so far it has been great. But we =
also need a regular forum.=20
<br>=20
<br> Roger Ver controls=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-a=
ba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"http://bitcoin.com">bitcoin.com</a>, as=
I understand?=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-a=
ba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"https://bitcoin.com/forum/">https://bit=
coin.com/forum/</a> would be nice.=20
<br>=20
<br> And it must be a real community, not "say whatever you wan=
t because free speech". We've seen how that turned out to be.=20
<br>=20
<br> Something like=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-a=
ba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"http://battle.net">battle.net</a> or St=
eam forums: heavily moderated, not for opinions, but for spam/noise/insults=
.=20
<br>=20
<br> Again, this needs leadership. Anyone can install a forum s=
oftware, what is needed is an "official seal of approval" and regular prese=
nce of top XT people there.=20
<br>=20
<br> And a will to setup proper moderation. Then people will mo=
ve.=20
<br>=20
<br> _______________________________________________=20
<br> bitcoin-dev mailing list=20
<br>=20
<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd=
851ae2f__href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@=
lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>=20
<br>=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-a=
ba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailm=
an/listinfo/bitcoin-dev">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo=
/bitcoin-dev</a>=20
<br>=20
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>
</div>
</div> </font>
<br>_______________________________________________
<br> bitcoin-dev mailing list
<br>=20
<a target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37-b10b-87cbd851ae2f_=
_href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.li=
nuxfoundation.org</a>
<br>=20
<a rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" removedlink__58ec13b3-aba4-4e37=
-b10b-87cbd851ae2f__href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listi=
nfo/bitcoin-dev">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin=
-dev</a>
<br>=20
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>=20
</div>
</div>
</div>
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