Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org (smtp1.osuosl.org [140.211.166.138]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C16E8C000A for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2021 09:31:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A271F8374F for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2021 09:31:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.497 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.497 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: smtp1.osuosl.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=jtimon-cc.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ui2ZaiNhww1s for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2021 09:31:57 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-ot1-x32d.google.com (mail-ot1-x32d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32d]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 88D2A83B8C for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2021 09:31:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-x32d.google.com with SMTP id h6-20020a0568300346b02901b71a850ab4so8873511ote.6 for ; Sun, 04 Apr 2021 02:31:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jtimon-cc.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=5ESkWWCJuTSmkj0kj8qb0h9uSz5BFsaYCPvVdTkKje0=; b=O5Oo59idPFmxmJ/HVe+e+KUuC2KGearYzUtLCxY663iFyuel06xeU7iS71Vj0AMlT+ eqJCqOTHqvRQnXe5lKx9fmWcgxW7u8GhjAd28P3LWVj2nvyJ9AXc+thfwlIe1w559apH 4cRAvPh2qCr0vYEQVLHeGJLMQIX+iQSM0JqimEF9wzHtW8wSbxOkDOC81mSQzZ1hzkG0 YiaXTxU6F+ey+WrIMjND+qK9xTBc8zaN/EyCnCjTk/EAtDbaBDxFtM8s8HYsnifLrM9j 3LRoZYy7TSSEBlO2mA1lh0kbd5QXrVhldPfc1zKsmG0euikn4OsMt0rE6fbJOlUPBfHk 7jFQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=5ESkWWCJuTSmkj0kj8qb0h9uSz5BFsaYCPvVdTkKje0=; b=LQaza7EVm1VgK47mRZCb/ZGxShoxbmOURn5LU6a/mzWI3xxF2gvlWkV9QIVjx58NjX PO2lVteFU6Bvv4c1cSUno01crGmD/0mG0pQZyCxu9rXjFVQLz4kVgdbQqehoW8K/Pb1g KBBrnJYelOD/IjToBpukn5/7mT9YLPhygyH5bRlwJib2Z5oNI2svhEkhSqRSUIsD8O2T izxSbl1kv6sM7+ETc4PDmsJxdfaBfsCIGZFYVpE3hG8cUSxKoGS3GA8LnqsbfQqHkS2g qJtuBUnSlrIBeIjBGc+qmboZaU/BJxb/VBJ/oQowHLq3/5wyepT0wh/So7k4Z9Mtww2g vDjA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530RvJMjAZ/u+f17FaBz2p6ocqCvWr1J8NbE4F0la7luB1+huIRq g/7uY9BBVGuGbkkwAvpsg0BQ1evNE2nKmzvDkPgdgQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzpiWjvE5GmGuDd+GjAKI9fFUAvr2oYBGeig7TGmfGVzETrFmd2fgu3xLFaqHe6W2v+8iep0OTC8BmNcXCbJLg= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:67c2:: with SMTP id c2mr18501122otn.343.1617528716099; Sun, 04 Apr 2021 02:31:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: =?UTF-8?B?Sm9yZ2UgVGltw7Nu?= Date: Sun, 4 Apr 2021 11:31:45 +0200 Message-ID: To: Jeremy , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000089927d05bf2240dc" Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Taproot Activation Meeting Reminder: April 6th 19:00 UTC bitcoin/bitcoin-dev X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 09:31:58 -0000 --00000000000089927d05bf2240dc Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" So the only thing that seemed clear, using height as per bip8, it's not clear anymore. And, as usual, we're not talking about activation in general but about taproot activation, segwit activation... I won't make it to the meeting because I don't think I have much more to contribute that I haven't said already beyond perhaps: sigh. My arguments will probably ignored again, so it doesn't matter. On Sun, Apr 4, 2021, 06:39 Jeremy via bitcoin-dev < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > We'll be having another meeting this Tuesday, as per > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2021-March/018699.html. > If you can't make it feel free to leave a comment on any agenda item below, > or if you think there are other things to be discussed. > > Agenda: > > 1. AJ's update to MTP time. > > Please review https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/21377 as AJ updated > it substantially. > > The PR is now purely MTP based, and the state machine has been simplified. > This approach is intended to be compatible with a mandatory signaling > period (via a LAST_CHANCE change) and makes it easier to deploy ST on > signets (irrelevant for Taproot, because it is already active on all > signets). > > 2. Selecting between MTP and Height > > In the previous meeting, there was no substantial publicly discussed > benefit to using MTPs over height. Since agenda item 1, there is now a > tangible benefit to using MTP. > > The changes AJ promulgated for MTP neutralizes the argument, mostly, that > MTP was easier to review. As such, the main conversation in this agenda > item is around the pros/cons of height or MTP and determining if we can > reach consensus on either approach. > > 3. Timeline Discussion > In all hope, we will reach consensus around item 2. Should that occur, we > can use this time to discuss a final selection on parameters, mindful of > Core's process. > > If the meeting doesn't reach rough consensus around item 2, it seems that > we may fall short on the proposed schedule from last time. In this section, > we can discuss realities around scheduling. > > > Best, > > Jeremy > > > > -- > @JeremyRubin > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > --00000000000089927d05bf2240dc Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
So the only thing that seemed clear, using height as per = bip8, it's not clear anymore.
And, as usual, we're= not talking about activation in general but about taproot activation, segw= it activation...

I won&#= 39;t make it to the meeting because I don't think I have much more to c= ontribute that I haven't said already beyond perhaps: sigh.
My arguments will probably ignored again, so it doesn't mat= ter.


=
On Sun, Apr 4, 2021, 06:39 Jeremy via= bitcoin-dev <b= itcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
We'll be having another me= eting this Tuesday, as per https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2021-March/018= 699.html. If you can't make it feel free to leave a comment on any agenda item= =20 below, or if you think there are other things to be discussed.

Agenda:

1. AJ's update to MTP time.

Ple= ase review https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2137= 7 as AJ updated it substantially.

The PR is now purely MTP based, and the state machine has been simplified.=20 This approach is intended to be compatible with a mandatory signaling=20 period (via a LAST_CHANCE change) and makes it easier to deploy ST on=20 signets (irrelevant for Taproot, because it is already active on all=20 signets).

2. Selecting between MTP and Height

In the previous meeting, there was no substantial publicly discussed=20 benefit to using MTPs over height. Since agenda item 1, there is now a=20 tangible benefit to using MTP.
The changes AJ promulgated for MTP neutralizes the argument, mostly, that=20 MTP was easier to review. As such, the main conversation in this agenda=20 item is around the pros/cons of height or MTP and determining if we can=20 reach consensus on either approach.

3. Timeline Discussion
In all hope, we will reach consensus around item 2. Should that occur, we=20 can use this time to discuss a final selection on parameters, mindful of Core's process.

If the meeting doesn't reach rough consensus around item 2, it seems that= =20 we may fall short on the proposed schedule from last time. In this=20 section, we can discuss realities around scheduling.


=
Best,

Jeremy



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