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From: Aaron Gustafson <jag426@cornell.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2015 11:56:34 -0700
Message-ID: <CAAocdpzYbCf6Tmhi6FvThPpEX4Hj4X+BPcPrNtpCK95yJmxM4g@mail.gmail.com>
To: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock.name>
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Cc: bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] User vote in blocksize through fees
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For the purposes of finding the median, halve < same < double. It will only
change if a majority of non-apathetic votes are for halve or a majority of
non-apathetic votes are for double.

On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 11:54 AM, Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock.name>
wrote:

> On Friday, 12 June 2015, at 7:44 pm, Peter Todd wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 02:36:31PM -0400, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> > > On Friday, 12 June 2015, at 7:34 pm, Peter Todd wrote:
> > > > On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 02:22:36PM -0400, Matt Whitlock wrote:
> > > > > Why should miners only be able to vote for "double the limit" or
> "halve" the limit? If you're going to use bits, I think you need to use two
> bits:
> > > > >
> > > > >         0 0 = no preference ("wildcard" vote)
> > > > >         0 1 = vote for the limit to remain the same
> > > > >         1 0 = vote for the limit to be halved
> > > > >         1 1 = vote for the limit to be doubled
> > > > >
> > > > > User transactions would follow the same usage. In particular, a
> user vote of "0 0" (no preference) could be included in a block casting any
> vote, but a block voting "0 0" (no preference) could only contain
> transactions voting "0 0" as well.
> > > >
> > > > Sounds like a good encoding to me. Taking the median of the three
> > > > options, and throwing away "don't care" votes entirely, makes sense.
> > >
> > > I hope you mean the *plurality* of the three options after throwing
> away the "don't cares," not the *median*.
> >
> > Median ensures that voting "no change" is meaningful. If "double" + "no
> > change" = 66%-1, you'd expect the result to be "no change", not "halve""
> > With a plurality vote you'd end up with a halving that was supported by
> > a minority.
>
> Never mind. I think I've figured out what you're getting at, and you're
> right. We wouldn't want "halve" to win on a plurality just because the
> remaining majority of the vote was split between double and
> remain-the-same. Good catch. :)
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>



-- 
J. Aaron Gustafson
Cornell University '16 | Computer Science, Engineering | Mathematics, Arts
& Sciences
Vice President, Kappa Delta Rho
jag426@cornell.edu | Ithaca, New York

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<div dir=3D"ltr">For the purposes of finding the median, halve &lt; same &l=
t; double. It will only change if a majority of non-apathetic votes are for=
 halve or a majority of non-apathetic votes are for double.</div><div class=
=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 11:=
54 AM, Matt Whitlock <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bip@mattwhitlo=
ck.name" target=3D"_blank">bip@mattwhitlock.name</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px=
 #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5">On Fr=
iday, 12 June 2015, at 7:44 pm, Peter Todd wrote:<br>
&gt; On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 02:36:31PM -0400, Matt Whitlock wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt; On Friday, 12 June 2015, at 7:34 pm, Peter Todd wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 02:22:36PM -0400, Matt Whitlock wrot=
e:<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Why should miners only be able to vote for &quot;double=
 the limit&quot; or &quot;halve&quot; the limit? If you&#39;re going to use=
 bits, I think you need to use two bits:<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 0 =3D no preference =
(&quot;wildcard&quot; vote)<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A00 1 =3D vote for the l=
imit to remain the same<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01 0 =3D vote for the l=
imit to be halved<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01 1 =3D vote for the l=
imit to be doubled<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; User transactions would follow the same usage. In parti=
cular, a user vote of &quot;0 0&quot; (no preference) could be included in =
a block casting any vote, but a block voting &quot;0 0&quot; (no preference=
) could only contain transactions voting &quot;0 0&quot; as well.<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; Sounds like a good encoding to me. Taking the median of the =
three<br>
&gt; &gt; &gt; options, and throwing away &quot;don&#39;t care&quot; votes =
entirely, makes sense.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; I hope you mean the *plurality* of the three options after throwi=
ng away the &quot;don&#39;t cares,&quot; not the *median*.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Median ensures that voting &quot;no change&quot; is meaningful. If &qu=
ot;double&quot; + &quot;no<br>
&gt; change&quot; =3D 66%-1, you&#39;d expect the result to be &quot;no cha=
nge&quot;, not &quot;halve&quot;&quot;<br>
&gt; With a plurality vote you&#39;d end up with a halving that was support=
ed by<br>
&gt; a minority.<br>
<br>
</div></div>Never mind. I think I&#39;ve figured out what you&#39;re gettin=
g at, and you&#39;re right. We wouldn&#39;t want &quot;halve&quot; to win o=
n a plurality just because the remaining majority of the vote was split bet=
ween double and remain-the-same. Good catch. :)<br>
<div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
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pment@lists.sourceforge.net</a><br>
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" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/=
listinfo/bitcoin-development</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br>=
<div class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-famil=
y:arial;font-size:small">J. Aaron Gustafson</div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"=
font-family:arial;font-size:small">Cornell University &#39;16 | Computer Sc=
ience, Engineering | Mathematics, Arts &amp; Sciences</div><div style=3D"fo=
nt-family:arial;font-size:small">Vice President, Kappa Delta Rho</div><div =
style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:small"><a href=3D"mailto:jag426@cornel=
l.edu" target=3D"_blank">jag426@cornell.edu</a>=C2=A0| Ithaca, New York</di=
v></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
</div>

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