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Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 22:04:54 -0700
Message-ID: <CAK_HAC8TUfLavLjUQTVLzeqf5qppbPASd_W-gkpUpNWqDayC0w@mail.gmail.com>
From: Corey Haddad <corey3@gmail.com>
To: Dave Scotese <dscotese@litmocracy.com>
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Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Scaling Bitcoin conference micro-report
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If it turns out that the blocksize divide is hinging on differing developer
views on the nature of the threat posed by governments, perhaps it would be
better to defer to people who specialize in that area.  There are plenty of
them operating in the Bitcoin space.  I am familiar with some of the United
States based policy people, such as Jerry Brito, Alex Fowler, Constance
Choi, Jim Harper, Patrick Murck, etc..  If they are not sure how to frame
their ideas as they relate to this debate, maybe the devs could pose some
questions for them to answer.  If the bitcoin policy people are not of
help, maybe we should turn to some political philosophers or something.

The main idea here is that if this is a politics question, please consider
you may be outside your area of expertise.


On Sun, Sep 20, 2015 at 5:11 PM, Dave Scotese via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

> Mike wrote:
> ... Obama would like to restrict guns, but can't, because they are too
> popular (in the USA).
> ... Governments tolerate this sort of abuse [black markets] only because
> they believe, I think correctly, that Bitcoin can have great benefits for
> their ordinary voters and for now are willing to let the tech industry
> experiment.
>
> Those two reasons must be recognized for their differences.  What does it
> mean that something is "too popular" if the ultimate goal of government is
> "great benefits for their ordinary voters"?  It means the government
> assumes that some things are bad for people even though they are popular.
> Crystal meth and heroin come to mind.  This is a natural concern of all
> decent parents for their children, and the reason that cultures for
> millennia have had rites of passage, wherein the child takes on the
> responsibility of determining for him or her self whether or not a popular
> thing provides great benefits.  That responsibility is the birthright of
> every human being. Why is there an institution that usurps it?  How do the
> people within that institution benefit from being part of it?
>
> Some history to study and answer these questions includes:
>
>    - The origination of public schooling as motivated by Johann Fichte's
>    public letters to his king in response to Prussia's loss to Napolean at
>    Jena.
>    - Franz Oppenheimer's book, The State, tracing the origination of the
>    idea of a state, or group of people who make up and enforce laws.
>    - Carroll Quigley's history book, Tragedy and Hope.
>    - Larken Rose's book, Kicking the Dragon.
>    - The Republic, by Plato, but only once you understand those other
>    books.
>    - If you want a shortcut, John Taylor Gatto did a five-hour interview
>    which is now titled "The Ultimate History Lesson with John Taylor Gatto."
>    It is heavily sourced by its producer in case anyone wants to verify the
>    information he provides.
>
> I'm "notplato" for a reason.
>
> notplato
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">If it turns out that the blocksize divide is hinging on di=
ffering developer views on the nature of the threat posed by governments, p=
erhaps it would be better to defer to people who specialize in that area.=
=C2=A0 There are plenty of them operating in the Bitcoin space.=C2=A0 I am =
familiar with some of the United States based policy people, such as Jerry =
Brito, Alex Fowler, Constance Choi, Jim Harper, Patrick Murck, etc..=C2=A0 =
If they are not sure how to frame their ideas as they relate to this debate=
, maybe the devs could pose some questions for them to answer.=C2=A0 If the=
 bitcoin policy people are not of help, maybe we should turn to some politi=
cal philosophers or something.=C2=A0 <br><br>The main idea here is that if =
this is a politics question, please consider you may be outside your area o=
f expertise.<br><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmai=
l_quote">On Sun, Sep 20, 2015 at 5:11 PM, Dave Scotese via bitcoin-dev <spa=
n dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org" =
target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>&gt;</span> wrot=
e:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Mike wrote:<br><div>.=
.. Obama would=20
like to restrict guns, but can&#39;t, because they are too popular (in the=
=20
USA).</div><div>... Governments tolerate this
 sort of abuse [black markets] only because they believe, I think correctly=
, that=20
Bitcoin can have great benefits for their ordinary voters and for now=20
are willing to let the tech industry experiment.<br><br></div><div>Those tw=
o reasons must be recognized for their differences.=C2=A0 What does it mean=
 that something is &quot;too popular&quot; if the ultimate goal of governme=
nt is &quot;great benefits for their ordinary voters&quot;?=C2=A0 It means =
the government assumes that some things are bad for people even though they=
 are popular.=C2=A0 Crystal meth and heroin come to mind.=C2=A0 This is a n=
atural concern of all decent parents for their children, and the reason tha=
t cultures for millennia have had rites of passage, wherein the child takes=
 on the responsibility of determining for him or her self whether or not a =
popular thing provides great benefits.=C2=A0 That responsibility is the bir=
thright of every human being. Why is there an institution that usurps it?=
=C2=A0 How do the people within that institution benefit from being part of=
 it?<br><br></div><div>Some history to study and answer these questions inc=
ludes:<br><ul><li>The origination of public schooling as motivated by Johan=
n Fichte&#39;s public letters to his king in response to Prussia&#39;s loss=
 to Napolean at Jena.</li><li>Franz Oppenheimer&#39;s book, The State, trac=
ing the origination of the idea of a state, or group of people who make up =
and enforce laws.</li><li>Carroll Quigley&#39;s history book, Tragedy and H=
ope.</li><li>Larken Rose&#39;s book, Kicking the Dragon.</li><li>The Republ=
ic, by Plato, but only once you understand those other books.</li><li>If yo=
u want a shortcut, John Taylor Gatto did a five-hour interview which is now=
 titled &quot;The Ultimate History Lesson with John Taylor Gatto.&quot;=C2=
=A0 It is heavily sourced by its producer in case anyone wants to verify th=
e information he provides.<br></li></ul><p>I&#39;m &quot;notplato&quot; for=
 a reason.<br></p><p>notplato<br></p></div><div><br></div></div>
<br>_______________________________________________<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.=
linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mail=
man/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

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