Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org (smtp1.osuosl.org [IPv6:2605:bc80:3010::138]) by lists.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7C0BC0012; Mon, 6 Dec 2021 10:21:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3BF982977; Mon, 6 Dec 2021 10:21:11 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at osuosl.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: smtp1.osuosl.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from smtp1.osuosl.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1.osuosl.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4Dv6mmWqTJP7; Mon, 6 Dec 2021 10:21:10 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 X-Greylist: whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received: from mail-lf1-x136.google.com (mail-lf1-x136.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::136]) by smtp1.osuosl.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 81E8782907; Mon, 6 Dec 2021 10:21:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf1-x136.google.com with SMTP id m27so23973854lfj.12; Mon, 06 Dec 2021 02:21:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=K7izUeTOfRYLidZwuESYozJri12FpdF3p4xoVteVbyk=; b=B+mwXz1YpaQi/U0eZR493vtoysH7KrmGndMmRsPtvdhPtIRxCcpVNdqM3158Jz37/m I4+Dmp8ap0SrW0ZTKo9i1IlRcnkqXcngSW5FeAIV093OFk1j2xbWBm2Biu1L73rP1XWc 8XdmWeErkx+8zYGOAKRS7VwfACxNZkgBtefHg48JSuTrUlagaVlKs8RAhVdcyQyXmlov 1cUYQez+0pb4gShX8XfgjLAUUOw8mRSSM6rwCepg8zDfCtPAZC9YOvbk0JYL1DzD+Nb5 NARCgBfvgGVF9qKq6sBUXZMYiMNVTPBW+eAgdWXIvnzYdG0jDdYjIE3RK/sZb+PNPSYA 2HCQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=K7izUeTOfRYLidZwuESYozJri12FpdF3p4xoVteVbyk=; b=XtbDwFNTIWkKD8He09PTDIsHH+ABE+yiSL56vN+YYHRX1S9LOtMHIXeYTqvmi8jI2m hYtaSMltLjdEwYI+NW8AWJQN1NI8l6fhkxQmbkx2mlhPaXZch4rr0SUrURmLWtUbbMvG Z7AOqFYbZnoe030RMKm5xuUOl93cjwCrlT9qLP2wo5Vva82x/T3pV1gm9XaTxCI9mx2C k15oGAf1D/6/PP5BECgs+sNBAElWgtw7PWTT1OsFBEQnDDHdeJD6g5A+S0UqZIpehhoZ 922F553pXCqi+Fjt3V0PykHsjZQ1WNQTJmx4toYUCtMM8GfXduN2X3cY4Dbl/fVxlADo hvLg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532UBxSgfJ1hkugWCI7+uZIJQZKFSqB9PdPxvzDeMN96O4BeCoPH 8OrYhBYZXRfLiAxoOqxKQz1oClWINekxuAT+ZXE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyTHsSkqfB9v7ZU+MIdj9x7ajY/Bz39J0km0/mxlo6Gdi1AuR4ORyNd1IsHX9JfDB1uAY4sn/kvKNyDGqzOsgA= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:b1f:: with SMTP id w31mr33872219lfu.240.1638786068064; Mon, 06 Dec 2021 02:21:08 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Karl Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2021 05:20:55 -0500 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?H=C3=A9ctor_Jos=C3=A9_C=C3=A1rdenas_Pacheco?= , Bitcoin Protocol Discussion Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000732d3b05d2779d65" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 06 Dec 2021 10:36:41 +0000 Cc: lightning-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Sending OP_RETURN via Bitcoin Lightning X-BeenThere: bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 06 Dec 2021 10:21:12 -0000 --000000000000732d3b05d2779d65 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I'm not a bitcoin developer. On Mon, Dec 6, 2021, 5:05 AM H=C3=A9ctor Jos=C3=A9 C=C3=A1rdenas Pacheco vi= a bitcoin-dev < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > Hello all, > > I=E2=80=99ve been thinking about how OP_RETURN is being used to create an= d trade > NFTs on Bitcoin (think RarePepes, SoG and other new ones) and was wonderi= ng > if it=E2=80=99s possible to > Do you have a link to any of these protocols? make transactions with this opcode via Lightning. > > More specific questions could be: > > 1. Can opcodes like OP_RETURN be inside a channel=E2=80=99s opening or= closing > transaction? > 2. If so, could that OP_RETURN change hands within that channel or > network of channels? > > OP_RETURNs do not have ownership according to the bitcoin network. It is not hard to define a protocol that associates an OP_RETURN with ownership, and ownership could then be transferred via lightning by sending associated currency via lightning. Robustness improvements seem possible. > 1. If possible, could the OP_RETURN be divisible? Could one person > send a piece of a OP_RETURN just like one can do right now on the prim= ary > ledger or would it need to maintain the OP_RETURN code intact? > > OP_RETURNs themselves do not have ownership, but you can define a protoco= l that gives them divisible ownership, including via lightning. I=E2=80=99m assuming that, if possible, this would need a protocol layer pa= rallel > to Bitcoin/Lightning that stores and reads all Bitcoin transactions and t= he > ones which involve the node's channels as well as the ones with the > OP_RETURN, just like CounterParty does right now with the primary ledger. > > Thank in advance. > =E2=80=94=E2=80=94 > > *H=C3=A9ctor C=C3=A1rdenas*@hcarpach > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > --000000000000732d3b05d2779d65 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

I'm not a bitcoin developer.

On Mon, Dec 6, 2021, 5:05 A= M H=C3=A9ctor Jos=C3=A9 C=C3=A1rdenas Pacheco via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfo= undation.org> wrote:
Hello al= l,

I=E2=80=99ve been thinking about how OP_RETURN is bei= ng used to create and trade NFTs on Bitcoin (think RarePepes, SoG and other= new ones) and was wondering if it=E2=80=99s possible to
<= /div>

Do you have a link to any of these protocols?

make transactions with this opcode via Lightning.
<= div>
More specific questions could be:
  1. Can = opcodes like OP_RETURN be inside a channel=E2=80=99s opening or closing tra= nsaction?
  2. If so, could that OP_RETURN change hands within that chan= nel or network of channels?
OP_RETURNs do not have ownership accordi= ng to the bitcoin network.=C2=A0 It is not hard to define a protocol that a= ssociates an OP_RETURN with ownership, and ownership could then be transfer= red via lightning by sending associated currency via lightning.=C2=A0 Robus= tness improvements seem possible.

  • If possible, could the OP_RETURN be divisible? Could one person send a= piece of a OP_RETURN just like one can do right now on the primary ledger = or would it need to maintain the OP_RETURN code intact?
    • OP_RETURNs t= hemselves do not have ownership, but you can define a protocol that gives t= hem divisible ownership, including via lightning.
    <= div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space= ">
    I=E2=80=99m assuming that, if possible, this would need a prot= ocol layer parallel to Bitcoin/Lightning that stores and reads all Bitcoin = transactions and the ones which involve the node's channels as well as = the ones with the OP_RETURN, just like CounterParty does right now with the= primary ledger.

    Thank in advance.
    =E2=80=94=E2=80=94
    H=C3=A9ctor C=C3=A1rdenas
    @hcarpach

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    bitcoin-dev mailing list
    bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
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    --000000000000732d3b05d2779d65--