MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <8EF9A9A8-3EBE-4427-9745-1C494DF12E9A@gmx.com>
References: <CAKzdR-rPoByn=+CgsTc1ZnLkjwtYyJnbQLbn-VHOvz0dLciefQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<1489086.kGfJeeyi4a@garp>
	<CAAS2fgSyWaRfXHKWZYzZ4X8ksMECaO47dTXum67XwpTTYnbDXg@mail.gmail.com>
	<2081461.sDX5ARzIdv@garp>
	<CAAS2fgSsJ10P7YYAAsV4P6no3pC=WYozWuN64u=WLSB3h6cHwA@mail.gmail.com>
	<561325D4.5030800@thinlink.com>
	<8EF9A9A8-3EBE-4427-9745-1C494DF12E9A@gmx.com>
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2015 01:07:44 -0400
Message-ID: <CAKfs=Z-NuTrsSsLjPLFDatM9ye3_FLW=-hDrhQjO+biRvt=buw@mail.gmail.com>
From: NotMike Hearn <not.mike.hearn@gmail.com>
To: Peter R <peter_r@gmx.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113ed2a43841090521689c6f
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] This thread is not about the soft/hard fork
 technical debate
Precedence: list

--001a113ed2a43841090521689c6f
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

>
>
> On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 11:20 PM, Peter R via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

>
> > On Oct 5, 2015, at 6:37 PM, Tom Harding via bitcoin-dev <
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> >
> > On 10/5/2015 1:56 PM, Gregory Maxwell via bitcoin-dev wrote:
> >> In this case, I don't even believe we have any regulator contributors
> >> that disagree.
> >
> > Since Gavin Andresen chose you to be one of 4 people who decides whose
> > contributions are accepted to the Core project, shouldn't you recuse
> > yourself from referencing "regular contributor" as some kind of bar to
> > an opinion being worthy?
> >
> > You don't want to be accused of squelching a person's opinions by
> > nacking or sitting on commits, then turning around and branding those
> > opinions as worthless because they are not from a "regular contributor.=
"
> > Do you?
>
> Great point, Tom!
>
> In fact, you=E2=80=99ve just explained the dynamics that create =E2=80=9C=
centralizing
> pressure=E2=80=9D in regards to development:  If the weight of a person=
=E2=80=99s opinion
> is proportional to how many commits that person has made, and if the
> probability of getting a commit pulled is proportional to the weight of
> that person=E2=80=99s opinion, well=E2=80=A6I=E2=80=99m pretty sure this =
results in a differential
> equation that has a solution that results in ever-increasing centralized
> control of the code base.
>

Really great stuff, Mr. R! We can use differential equations to measure
centralization pressure (I'm pretty sure, good idea). If we want
decentralization (or even mere stability), we must impose a
counterbalancing rule such that each past commit makes one *less* likely to
get their next commit pulled. For example, a "one man one commit" policy.


>
> I believe we should work to deprecate the idea that Core is somehow the
> =E2=80=9Ccore of Bitcoin," in favour of multiple competing implementation=
s. XT and
> btcd are two working examples of this idea.  Let=E2=80=99s make it easier=
 for the
> community to determine the evolution of Bitcoin by making it easier for t=
he
> community to express their vote based on the code we choose to run.
>

Yes, this is essential. Greg, stop making it so hard for me to  determine
the evolution of Bitcoin by making it hard to express my vote based on the
code I choose to run. Blockstream is always doing that I am sick of it.

Mr. R really understands these concepts at a deep level and people need to
pay more attention to what he has to say. Nash equilibriums are very
important mathematical concept, for example:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3nhq5a/deprecating_bitcoin_core_v=
isualizing_the/


>
> Best regards,
> Peter
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>

--001a113ed2a43841090521689c6f
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px =
0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-l=
eft-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><br></blockquote><div class=3D"gmail_extr=
a"><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 11:20 PM, Peter R via =
bitcoin-dev <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linux=
foundation.org" target=3D"_blank">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px=
 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);bor=
der-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=3D""><br>
&gt; On Oct 5, 2015, at 6:37 PM, Tom Harding via bitcoin-dev &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfound=
ation.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On 10/5/2015 1:56 PM, Gregory Maxwell via bitcoin-dev wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; In this case, I don&#39;t even believe we have any regulator contr=
ibutors<br>
&gt;&gt; that disagree.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Since Gavin Andresen chose you to be one of 4 people who decides whose=
<br>
&gt; contributions are accepted to the Core project, shouldn&#39;t you recu=
se<br>
&gt; yourself from referencing &quot;regular contributor&quot; as some kind=
 of bar to<br>
&gt; an opinion being worthy?<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; You don&#39;t want to be accused of squelching a person&#39;s opinions=
 by<br>
&gt; nacking or sitting on commits, then turning around and branding those<=
br>
&gt; opinions as worthless because they are not from a &quot;regular contri=
butor.&quot;<br>
&gt; Do you?<br>
<br>
</span>Great point, Tom!<br>
<br>
In fact, you=E2=80=99ve just explained the dynamics that create =E2=80=9Cce=
ntralizing pressure=E2=80=9D in regards to development:=C2=A0 If the weight=
 of a person=E2=80=99s opinion is proportional to how many commits that per=
son has made, and if the probability of getting a commit pulled is proporti=
onal to the weight of that person=E2=80=99s opinion, well=E2=80=A6I=E2=80=
=99m pretty sure this results in a differential equation that has a solutio=
n that results in ever-increasing centralized control of the code base.<br>=
</blockquote><div>=C2=A0</div><div>Really great stuff, Mr. R! We can use di=
fferential equations to measure centralization pressure (I&#39;m pretty sur=
e, good idea). If we want decentralization (or even mere stability), we mus=
t impose a counterbalancing rule such that each past commit makes one *less=
* likely to get their next commit pulled. For example, a &quot;one man one =
commit&quot; policy.<br></div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_q=
uote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-c=
olor:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
I believe we should work to deprecate the idea that Core is somehow the =E2=
=80=9Ccore of Bitcoin,&quot; in favour of multiple competing implementation=
s. XT and btcd are two working examples of this idea.=C2=A0 Let=E2=80=99s m=
ake it easier for the community to determine the evolution of Bitcoin by ma=
king it easier for the community to express their vote based on the code we=
 choose to run.<br></blockquote><div><br>Yes, this is essential. Greg, stop=
 making it so hard for me to =C2=A0determine the evolution of Bitcoin by ma=
king it hard to express my vote based on the code I choose to run. Blockstr=
eam is always doing that I am sick of it.<br><br>Mr. R really understands t=
hese concepts at a deep level and people need to pay more attention to what=
 he has to say. Nash equilibriums are very important mathematical concept, =
for example: =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3nh=
q5a/deprecating_bitcoin_core_visualizing_the/">https://www.reddit.com/r/Bit=
coin/comments/3nhq5a/deprecating_bitcoin_core_visualizing_the/</a><br></div=
><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px=
 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-=
left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Best regards,<br>
Peter<br>
<div class=3D""><div class=3D"h5">_________________________________________=
______<br>
bitcoin-dev mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org">bitcoin-dev@lists.=
linuxfoundation.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev" =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mail=
man/listinfo/bitcoin-dev</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div>

--001a113ed2a43841090521689c6f--