Delivery-date: Sat, 03 May 2025 05:00:49 -0700
Sender: bitcoindev@googlegroups.com
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of gregtonoski@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::1135 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::1135;
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <rhfyCHr4RfaEalbfGejVdolYCVWIyf84PT2062DQbs5-eU8BPYty5sGyvI3hKeRZQtVC7rn_ugjUWFnWCymz9e9Chbn7FjWJePllFhZRKYk=@protonmail.com>
 <03be4934-f0ff-4b58-880d-861d63a4f970@dashjr.org>
In-Reply-To: <03be4934-f0ff-4b58-880d-861d63a4f970@dashjr.org>
From: Greg Tonoski <gregtonoski@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 2 May 2025 20:56:59 +0200
Message-ID: <CAMHHROx7s31+cdKe0d3BdZDcjgshvsLc=fdS_JFmA5Ve=kBuJw@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [bitcoindev] Relax OP_RETURN standardness restrictions
To: bitcoindev@googlegroups.com, Luke Dashjr <luke@dashjr.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list bitcoindev@googlegroups.com; contact bitcoindev+owners@googlegroups.com

It can't be a serious proposal therefore I didn't answer it.
Bitcoiners run node software without that prospective bug so they
already decided against the change. I also care about Bitcoin's
survival and I agree with you. Thank you for Bitcoin Knots which is
more powerful and less buggy Bitcoin node software implementation,
superior to Bitcoin Core..

On Sat, Apr 26, 2025 at 11:53=E2=80=AFAM Luke Dashjr <luke@dashjr.org> wrot=
e:
>
> It should be needless to say, but this idea is utter insanity. Disappoint=
ing to see positive responses, and not one sensible reply calling it out ye=
t. The bugs should be fixed, not the abuse embraced. If attackers continue =
to bypass filters, we can go back to a full whitelist approach. We're now 2=
+ years into this wave of attacks, and the damage it has already done shoul=
d be more than enough to prove the hands-off attitude is not viable. Am I t=
he only one left on this list who actually cares about Bitcoin's survival?
>
> On 4/17/25 14:52, 'Antoine Poinsot' via Bitcoin Development Mailing List =
wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Standardness rules exist for 3 mains reasons: mitigate DoS vectors, provi=
de upgrade hooks, or as a nudge to deter some usages.
>
> Bitcoin Core will by default only relay and mine transactions with at mos=
t a single OP_RETURN output, with a scriptPubKey no larger than 83 bytes. T=
his standardness rule falls into the third category: it aims to mildly dete=
r data storage while still allowing a less harmful alternative than using n=
on-provably-unspendable outputs.
>
> Developers are now designing constructions that work around these limitat=
ions. An example is Clementine, the recently-announced Citrea bridge, which=
 uses unspendable Taproot outputs to store data in its "WatchtowerChallenge=
" transaction due to the standardness restrictions on the size of OP_RETURN=
s[^0]. Meanwhile, we have witnessed in recent years that the nudge is ineff=
ective to deter storing data onchain.
>
> Since the restrictions on the usage of OP_RETURN outputs encourage harmfu=
l practices while being ineffective in deterring unwanted usage, i propose =
to drop them. I suggest to start by lifting the restriction on the size of =
the scriptPubKey for OP_RETURN outputs, as a first minimal step to stop enc=
ouraging harmful behaviour, and to then proceed to lift the restriction on =
the number of OP_RETURN outputs per transactions.
>
> Antoine Poinsot
>
> [^0]: See section 6.1 of their whitepaper here https://citrea.xyz/clement=
ine_whitepaper.pdf
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups=
 "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an=
 email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoinde=
v/rhfyCHr4RfaEalbfGejVdolYCVWIyf84PT2062DQbs5-eU8BPYty5sGyvI3hKeRZQtVC7rn_u=
gjUWFnWCymz9e9Chbn7FjWJePllFhZRKYk%3D%40protonmail.com.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups=
 "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an=
 email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoinde=
v/03be4934-f0ff-4b58-880d-861d63a4f970%40dashjr.org.

--=20
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e=
mail to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/=
CAMHHROx7s31%2BcdKe0d3BdZDcjgshvsLc%3DfdS_JFmA5Ve%3DkBuJw%40mail.gmail.com.